The Truth About Logitech “Ditching” Google TV

If you’ve read any of the news about Logitech and Google TV over the past 24 hours or so, you’ve probably already heard about Logitech discontinuing the Revue (“ditching” Google TV) and calling it a “gigantic mistake”. Unfortunately, most of these articles are just a lot of catch phrases and hype. It seems no one wants to actually read the transcript from the conference call with Logitech’s CEO. What everyone does seem to want to do is throw around the same catch phrases and rewrite the exact same story over and over on every web site on the internet. I’m here to give you a different perspective on this story.

First, I’d like to start by “calling out” some of these shoddy catch phrases and misguided points one by one. These same “facts” have been regurgitated all over the web- mostly because no one on the internet actually writes anything any more, they all just “rewrite” the same story on 100 different sites.

Did Logitech CEO Guerrino De Luca Call Google TV a “beta product”?

Multiple news stories across the web claim Logitech’s CEO called Google TV a beta product, saying Logitech “executed a full scale launch with a beta product and it cost us dearly.” For example, Tech Radar states in their article: “He added: “We executed a full scale launch with a beta product and it cost us dearly.”

But these words never actually came out of Guerrino De Luca’s mouth, then where did they get this quote?

They got it from a slide shown on the screen while De Luca was speaking. The words that came out of his mouth however were a bit different, although no one cared to mention this in their articles.

“Logitech Revue was launched with some, I wouldn’t call it beta properly but a software that was not complete and not tuned to what the consumers want at the living room” - Guerrino De Luca, Logitech CEO

De Luca made it a very clear point to not call Google TV a beta product when he was speaking. And although his slides made a different statement, De Luca made a very clear and purposeful contradictory statement to what was written on those slides.

Guerrino De Luca Logitech CEO

Did De Luca say Google TV can’t succeed?

This was mentioned in a lot of articles across the web, claiming De Luca said “a grandchild of Google TV” could succeed, but not the current Google TV product. Let me give you an example from the LA Times: “Further, he predicted that the “grandchild of Google TV” might succeed but not the current product. “

Now lets take a look at what De Luca actually said on this matter, it’s not anything like what is being portrayed in some of these articles:

“Google TV is a great concept, Google TV has the potential to completely disrupt living room, except that was not the case when we launched Logitech Revue.”…”Google TV or a child of Google TV or the grandchild of Google TV will happen. The integration of television in Internet is inevitable. But the idea that it would happen overnight in Christmas 2010 was very misguided and that also caused us dearly.” – Guerrino De Luca, Logitech CEO

Now this is a far cry from saying the current product can not succeed, but maybe a grandchild of it could. Perhaps it’s a matter of reading comprehension, but what I gather from these statements is that De Luca is saying Google TV could not succeed in 2010, but it is a great concept that will succeed, either in it’s current implementation or a future one.

What was Logitech’s real mistake?

Every news source on the web wants to latch on to De Luca’s statements about Logitech’s mistake, and the articles make it seem that Google TV as a product is to blame when this is not the case at all. De Luca actually says that he would do it all over again, only on a smaller scale. The real mistake was that they made too many Revue’s when there wasn’t the demand for them. But, of course, this story doesn’t make for as good of a headline as something like “Logitech Says Google TV Epic Ginormous Mistake!”, now does it?

“I would do it again, I would definitely want to have Google establish Google TV, but with a significantly smaller and more prudent approach.” - Guerrino De Luca, Logitech CEO

This is just like any product in any category, if you make too many products in relation to your customer base, you’re going to have to eat them. This is true whether you’re Logitech, Apple, or the pizza place down the street.

Economic-surpluses

Logitech didn’t want to be in the set top box business in the first place.

This is a huge point from De Luca’s presentation that pretty much no one chose to quote in their articles on this subject. Logitech never wanted to be in the set top box business in the first place. The Logitech Revue was not planned to be a long term product, Logitech just wanted to help jump-start the platform:

“So, let me be very clear, it was never our strategy to make money out of set top boxes for Google TV. Our choice to build one was a choice driven by their willingness to accelerate the adoption of the platform and to be part of the first wave of people that could influence its development. We accomplished that” - Guerrino De Luca, Logitech CEO

Think about it, what does Logitech make? Keyboards, mice, web cams, speakers, remotes- they’re an accessory company, not a TV set top box company. I’m sure they had their reasons for wanting to influence the development of this platform though, and I am willing to bet it had a lot to do with accessories.

So what’s the real story here?

The real story, in a nutshell, is that Logitech won’t be making any more Revue set top boxes. Not because Google TV sucks, or is a huge mistake, but because Logitech is an accessory company. The Logitech Revue was an experiment for them and a way to influence the development of a new platform, but they overestimated the demand for their product and lost some money on it. Google TV not being ready for prime time in 2010 didn’t help much either. That’s the real story here, no need for these “news sites” to dog pile Google TV with misleading quotes and hyped headlines- but I guess that is what gets the “clicks”, after all.

(all quotes from Seeking Alpha conference call transcript)

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exiquio 6 pts

Great article. Got a Revue used recently. Best 90 dollars I've spent.

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killer4110 35 pts

exiquio Have you side loaded any apps yet?

killer4110exiquio No

exiquio You can find video's on side loading apps onto your Google TV, you would be surprised at the amount of app/games that work on the TV.

NerdUno 8 pts

Still waiting on that Google TV update that Logitech promised in a couple weeks (over a month ago). Of course, we're still waiting on Google Market access than Logitech promised for (last) January. Certainly will make you think twice before buying the next Logitech VaporWare.

israel.kendall 59 pts moderator

NerdUno Today they officially said the update is rolling out this week!

My latest conversation: Logitech Says They're Rolling Out Google TV 2.0 Honeycomb Update - For Real This Time

Agzam 8 pts

israel.kendallNerdUno It means after the Christmas. Of the next year. Maybe

Jaybird 17 pts

israel.kendallNerdUno This is good new if it is true -- I will not hold my breath ...

LaithCharles 6 pts

Google recently bought out Motorola. Motorola are know for their TV set boxes, part of their incentive to purchase this $12 Billion company was clearly to further Google TV. Google are an advertising titan, that is the main source of their revenue, they will keep pushing Google TV until it catches on enough for them to push adds on our TVs as well. The Logitech Revue will receive updates, whether private programmers further the OS or Google themselves pick up the slack, they will eventually update users to an interface which can earn Google some advertising money. Google would never make that many units and that much opportunity go to waste.

LaithCharles Well said. While Google surely purchased Motorola for their patents, there are lots of fringe benefits of their acquisition. One of them being to further Google TV, and another could be Motorola's smart home technology, Motorola 4Home. http://www.motorola.com/Video-Solutions/US-EN/Solution-Sites/4HOME/Overview Check it out if you haven't seen it before.

Well, I got my email from Logitech on 10-31 to expect the long awaited android update within the next few weeks, and now it is going on 4 (weeks.) So I guess they have put this on the back burner, knowing there is really no point in rushing this thing to the public any more. Before they decided to dump the Revue there was an incentive , especially with Christmas coming, to include the update in the products sold during these busy shopping days, but that is obviously no longer a concern. How disappointing for those of us who bought their orphaned product. It makes me not want to buy any products from Logitech in the future.

Jaybird You're right, they don't seem to be in much of a hurry.

My latest conversation: Spartify App Liable to Render Classic DJ Equipment Obsolete

Where the heck the update then? You've been promising it since Summer of 2011. Frankly it's my own fault - I did a terrible mistake by flashing leaked Honeycomb beta update. It made my box useless (Netflix doesn't work, Flash player crashes). Now I think you guys totally abandoned the product and there won't be any official updates. This really sucks. Stick to the making mouses from now on and don't disgrace yourself.

Agzam They do make a pretty good mouse...

My latest conversation: The Future of Logitech Revue, Google TV, and More - Q&A with GTV Product Manager

I just watched a video on YouTube reviewing the 3.1 update for GoogleTV. While on the whole it was positive, it did mention several drawbacks, such as not being able to close running apps like you can now with the current version. The reviewer, from "the unLockr.com", expressed hope that these omissions and screw ups in the latest version would be corrected in future updates. He also said that he hoped that Hulu would soon make itself available for the GoogleTV market, and that all the major networds would eventually unlock their content to Google.

My question is this -- we all know the Revue is history -- will GoogleTV be dumped too? Or will GoogleTV continue to support software updates for the Revue?

I ask this because in the video the reviewer begins by commenting on Logitech's calling the Revue a mistake, but despite this, the reviewer time and again expressed hope, and even some confidence that he believes the software will continue to be improved. Does this mean the Revue might still have a future? Or was this guy just expressing what he would like to see happen? This is confusing because I really can't understand why the guy at the unLockr.com was so optimistic in light of recent events.

Jaybird While the apps he's talking about in the video aren't actually "running" or using system resources, it would be more convenient to have a simple way to remove them from the list. Though, you can always install a task killer.

The Google TV Product Director told us in a recent hangout that they are in talks with Hulu to bring an app to Google TV, they just don't have a definite date yet. Also, a product manager did a Q&A session (linked in the comments here) and during the session he made it sound as if the Revue will still be receiving updates.

I can't speak for the guy from theunlocker, or what he knows. But, click the link that shows up under this comment, it's the Q&A session I mentioned with the product manager. He talks about the Revue as if it has a definite future, complete with software support. He even tells us not to count Logitech out, and expect to hear more from them in regards to Google TV. Check it out, if you haven't already.

israel.kendall One way they could at least temporarily regain a lot of customer's confidence would be to hurry up and release this long awaited update. I received an email from them on 10/31/11, telling me that it would be coming "in a few weeks". While "a few" is kind of ambiguous, I have always taken it to mean 2 to 3. Well, it is going on to 3 weeks and this delay, combined the news that Logitech is dumping the Revue, makes me think that Logitech might have lost whatever sense of urgency they had with anything involving the improvement of a discontinued product. I mean why should they hurry? One incentive they should have is that the same people who bought the Revue also buy keyboards and mice. We might lose our enthusiasm for their products if they put support for the Revue on the back burner.

So, releasing the update soon would help sagging moral and customer relations.

Jaybird Maybe someone could talk the Cyanogen mod guys in to making mods for the Logitech Revue? That would be awesome, then we wouldn't even have to worry about this Logitech stuff...

saramtevis 16 pts

Good post, thanks, this should be all over the web.

saramtevis Thanks, it's getting around the web a little bit, but it will never get quite the attention that the bigger sites get unfortunately... Thanks for reading!

macksjunkbocks 8 pts

i love my revue, i have a external hd hooked up use it daily. its not worth $300, but worth $100 as is imo. would love an upgrade though. they should of made it bundles it with the accessories for $300 webcam they keyboard and a extra remote or something maybe an extra unify dongle to use it on pc too. they should have put more ads again with the price drop. this article points out that the ceo was taken out of context. im sure if they started selling more units or webcams they would make more, besides the webcam WOULD be awesome if more people had it.

macksjunkbocks More people would have the webcam if it weren't ridiculously expensive! Also, it would be awesome to have Google+ Hangouts supported on GTV.

knam25 10 pts

israel.kendallmacksjunkbocks I am one of the suckers who bought the $150 webcam. It is way too expensive for consumer webcam but if you think about how much biz conferencing kits cost, actually it is quite a bargain. I wouldn't have bought it just for home use though.

knam25macksjunkbocks Good point, it would be a good deal for businesses. Perhaps they should have made a business model and a consumer model.

When people can get a USB cam for 30 bucks or less, it's hard to justify forking out $150 for one.

RyanZimmerman 6 pts

If the Revue's software updates were officially abandoned, that wouldn't mean that updates would never happen. You would just need to look to outside sources for the updates. Like many platforms (like the WII, LinkSys Routers and much more), GTV has a community out there of programmers who create methods for unofficially upgrading the software. Many have already updated their Revues with Honeycomb.

And when it comes down to it, $299 was just not the correct price point.

RyanZimmerman Good point!

virtuasian 6 pts

Does this mean that Logitech revue would not get the Honeycomb upgrade?

or can someone provide a Hack to get onto the Google TV android market otherwise I am going to use the box as a $99 paperweight.

virtuasian The Logitech Revue is still getting the Honeycomb update. I wouldn't hold my breath for any major updates after that though.

I wanted to clarify something I commented on concerning younger people trending away from television these days. This statement is not based on any marketing research or anything like that. I was basing it on the fact that every time my daughter's friends come over, or when any similar aged relatives (aged 13 - 16) visit, they never sit around watching movies or TV shows. This hardly ever happens unless we sit them down in the living room and make them watch something. No, these kids won't do that on their own. What they like to do is watch you tube or stare blankly at various FaceBook pages. If they are not doing this on a laptop or computer, they are doing it on their smart phones. It is actually kind of disturbing having a house full of kids all preoccupied with their various social networking devices and not interacting much with the real people in the room with them. Then I look around and their parents, including me are doing basically the same thing. What is this world coming to? Anyway, that is why I don't believe TV or cable TV's future is so bright.

Jaybird I agree with you on all points pretty much. Socialization has completely changed as well as the way we consume media.

The bottom line is that if the latest honey comb 3.1 upgrade for the revue comes out, this will be the final upgrade forever. I have seen this happen before. It is kind of sad. Remember the Amiga. I even bought a promising MP4 player from Archer, then they abandoned support and it became obsolete as soon as the next Flash player update came out but could not be installed because of lack of support. The same fate awaits the Revue due to the fact it will not allow anything but official upgrades to be installed. Stick a fork in the Revue -- it is done.

Jaybird I'd have to agree on the updates. I'm hoping another company (possibly LG?) will make a nice Google TV set top box. I am not one for buying a TV or Blu-ray with GTV integrated as this makes it very costly to upgrade the hardware. Someone needs to make something to fill this gap that will be left behind by the absence of the Revue.

israel.kendall If the Android upgrade comes out, the Revue will have life for a year or so. But I think a used laptop with HDMI will do just fine as a settop box until something really big hits the market that will combine tv and the internet.

The tricky part seems to be creating an easy to use interface that lets you do both at the same time, with software that recognizes the difference so that users can manipulate both TV selections and the internet separately -- but at the same time. This is where it gets complicated for programmers and users, I believe.

The other thing that Logitech obviously did not want to touch was that the Revue should have also been a DVR, but now we are talking money, and an even more complicated user interface for the public to get upset about.

Anyway. I think most folks, especially those under 40, are trending away from television, especially with the high costs, and the lack of individual station selections of Cable and Satellight TV. The idea that you have to pay fo 150 stations when 120 of them are pure crap is just born of greed and nothing else. Comcast's European investors even told them this. One day it will be like AM Radio is today, mostly used by old folks.

A lot of people are simply using their smart phones as their media device of choice these days. So the bar for quality has really been lowered. I feel sorry for the folks who dished out 300 bucks for the Revue and kept it.

Jaybird Cable TV really needs to change their subscription models and allow people to only pay for what they want. Then all those extra channels no one watches will fade away as they should have long ago.

I've not payed for cable in about 4 or 5 years now (not gotten it illegally either). But a couple of years back I thought about just getting the "basic" plan. So I called the cable company and asked them the price and details. They told me around 20 bucks for 20-30 channels. I said it sounds great, they're all High Def right?

Nope. For the HD channels I would have had to buy the "digital" service and all the add on's that add up to over $100.

I told them I was currently getting over 20 HD channels OTA with my "rabbit ear" antenna and didn't feel like paying 20 bucks to downgrade to standard definition cable service. How ridiculous is that?

israel.kendallJaybird Yes, you need to pay about $80/mo to get decent line up of channels. I tried "cutting the cable" for about 6 months. But I only get 1 OTA channel at my house because of the location and metal roof on my house. But "resistance was futile" against baseball season. I think sports packages are what's keeping the cable companies alive. And the internet access. Just about everything else I could get on internet legal or illegal but sports isn't the same watching after knowing score.

knam25Jaybird You're right, sports is the biggest thing keeping a lot of people subscribed to cable or satellite.

When they moved Monday Night Football to ESPN, that one really hurt the cord cutters too.

The truth of the matter for me was that Google TV was going to be the way I would free myself from paying the ripoff cable bills. And that is kind of how it was sold to me -- a device that would search the web for content, grabbing free content from network sites and all the rest, then organize it into my own channels. At the time, Google TV had a subscription fee , something like 7 bucks a month. That small fee plus the NetFlix subscriptiion would be a lot cheaper than cable. I think Google dumped the monthly fee when you bought a Revue, or else they just got rid of it all together.

But this dream wasn't to be. And to add insult to injury, Logitech dumps the Revue and Netflix raises their monthly fee by 60 %. So now I am stuck with the same 150 channels of crap.

Someone should investigate what it costs to run a station like "The Military Channel." This is a station that basically borrows 90 % of its programming from the reruns of other stations, such as History, etc,. It is basically like a guy in an apartment somewhere playing a bunch of videos and commercials. They have to pay for announcers and copy writers, but what else? Rent? And the maddening thing is that there are tons of stations just like this with nearly zero original programming -- just old reruns playing. You know, some guy with a bunch of old VHS tapes and calling it a Network.

Sorry, I get to ranting every time I post here.

Jaybird Great point about how much it costs to run one of those "Rerun TV" networks, feel free to rant any time!

As for Netflix, I think they were hoping the price hike would make everyone switch to the streaming only plan so they could cut costs. It didn't really effect me though, as I have been a streaming only subscriber to Netflix for a long time.

israel.kendall I find the streaming video library of Netflix sadly lacking. By trying to drop the DVD market, they have most likely doomed their little company, especially in this age of the "99 %'ers". People should use their Revues (if they still have them) and check the anger of disgruntled Netflix users on YouTube. These guys aren't coming back.

I believe Blockbuster is coming up with something to challenge Netflix, but the price point is still more than Netflix's cost if one does both streaming and Dvd rental.

Jaybird Netflix is in some big trouble, they angered their customer base at exactly the wrong time- right when they have competition rising all around them.

rfox131 8 pts

This is a two parter: the reporting and the technology. The reporting is worse than the state that was claimed of GoogleTV in their articles. We count on those closer to the source to give adequate reports It reveals the sad state of what is called "The Press" these days.

As for GoogleTV and the Revue: Both were in their infancy and GoogleTV has a chance if the choke hold of certain content outlets can be broken. No access to some content is one of the biggest detractors. I have high hopes for all alternative content and their providers.

This was posted from a Logitech Revue.

rfox131 I have been searching for days now for an article i read, it was a quote from i think the CEO of CBS, and he stated the reason they wont sign on with Google, and that reason is because the Cable and Satellite providers pay the networks the money upfront,which amounts to billions, but Google wants to pay them through ad revenue sharing, they want the money upfront, not in payments.

I will keep searching for the whole article and if i find it i will pass it on to gnarld

killer4110 Maybe Google should just put up the money then and help get their platform off the ground. Once GTV gets big enough, they can start calling the shots.

israel.kendall Well, i know right now DirecTV is fighting with Fox, Fox wants to raise the price it charges DirecTV, DirecTV pays Fox over 1 billion a year for the channels they provide,now imagine all the networks charging Google,and you know they are going to want more from Google.

Comcast, Viacom and Time Warner are some of the ones I've heard brought up. It comes down to who gets paid and how. What was supposed to be a way for rural communities to get content has ballooned into a multi-billion dollar scam with our government's hand in the mess the whole way.

rfox131 Great point, I haven't even thought of it that way.

rfox131 On Google TV, I agree totally. The content is key, and I think the networks will begin to come around once the dollar signs are in alignment. The Wall Street Journal is having a major success with their streaming news application. Also, Disney is starting to come around and recently teamed up with YouTube to create original programming. I think that's a pretty big deal, because Disney was one of the networks who originally blocked GTV.

Excellent article. It's sad main stream media is going yellow on us. No such thing as journalistic integrity any more. I see this kind of sensational journalism on NY Times, Washington Post, etc. everyday. Political coverage is even worse in many cases.

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Joshua Martelle

dang that sucks

so does that mean they havnt got there update yet?

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